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New burner for a vertical engine
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tmuir


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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 1:11 pm    Post subject: New burner for a vertical engine Reply with quote

I'm making a new burner to go with the Renown I've just sold so thought I would start a thread showing how I make them.
I hope to have this burner finished by the end of the weekend.

A group photo showing the real ugly looking burner I made before I had a lathe but it works great. My nice brass burner on the right and some brass pipe in the middle.
The one on the right is for Scorpion engines but the firebox is smaller in a Renown so the burner can't be as tall so I plan to make this one the same hight as the ugly burner.



Being brass after sawing off a length I could put it on the lathe and true up the end which is something you can't do if you make it from copper.
For the end plates I am using 1.2mm brass sheet which I got very cheap off 'offcuts-galore' on Oztion some time ago.
I am pretty sure they are old brass kick plates off a door, but they are great for this sort of stuff.

A small bit was cut off the sheet and cleaned up.
Once I had fluxed everything I cut a number of short lengths off my 1.2mm silver solder rod and carefully placed them inside the tube against the joint. I then applied heat only from the outside and once it was hot enough the solder just flowed into the joints. When this happens you can watch the silver streak run around and follow the flame.

Soldered and cooled down.


Cleaned in my old jewellers pickle.

See the nice bead of silver around the joint.

Tomorrow I will use tin snaps to roughly cut off the excess and then the lathe to get the last.
Then I will make the filling bush and bolt.
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A nice example of an Australian made Scorpion Donkey Engine
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whistleman


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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

looking great!
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xlchainsaw


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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 4:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

excellent. this will be a great thread.
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Stilldrillin


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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That`s great Tony!  

I need more soldering confidence....  
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Les


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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 5:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's looking good Tony, did the original burner incorporate a handle??
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tmuir


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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 6:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Les wrote:
That's looking good Tony, did the original burner incorporate a handle??


Yes it did and I am planning on putting a handle on this one.
I just haven't decided the best way yet.
I don't know wherther to bend up some brass sheet and solder to the side of the brass pipe or to drill a tight fitting hole into the brass pipe and push in a  brass rod in and solder it.

Will decide when I get to that part
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Lozza1


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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nice job with that solder Tony

Are you using a silver solder on the burner?

Edit: I just re-read the post    It helps when you read it properly.

Another question though- Is brazing any more difficult? or expensive?
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xlchainsaw


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lozza1 wrote:
nice job with that solder Tony

Are you using a silver solder on the burner?

Edit: I just re-read the post    It helps when you read it properly.

Another question though- Is brazing any more difficult? or expensive?
the word braze in welding terms actually means heating 2 metals ...they can be the same or different and using a filler rod to apply a melted metal to cause a joining of metal....... so simple soldering with lead and tin could be called brazing........ however in general talk.... the word braze was commonly used to refer to welding by using a brass. or a composition of brass filler rod..... however nowadays..... aluminium...stainless..... cast iron and others can now be "brazed!! due to special fluxes and filler rods. 30 yrs ago here in oz it was common talk...... "i will bronze that!!! meaning to braze using a composition brass filler rod.

to "bronze" rather than "silver solder"  .... will require a higher heat torch than propane/lpg  
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flywheel61


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are the correct burners for Scorpion & Renown verticals,

Scorpion on the left and Renown on the right, neither have a filler plug, the Scorpion handle, is just a bit of rolled up soft metal, maybe brass - I'll find out one day, when I clean it up,    



Both tanks are sougth from other sources, the Scorpion tanks, looks very much like a paint sample pot & the Renown tank looks like it was a pill tin - why make your own burner tanks when the can be adapted,    



Cheers    

Chris
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tmuir


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lozza1 wrote:
nice job with that solder Tony

Are you using a silver solder on the burner?

Edit: I just re-read the post    It helps when you read it properly.

Another question though- Is brazing any more difficult? or expensive?


It is more expensive.
The silver solder I use is about 50% silver so obviously that is more expensive than soft solder.
I have soldered something this size before just using my MAPP gas burner with disposable bottle but I find it is easier if I use my large propane burner as it puts out more heat.
So it costs more to set up but is not really harder.
Cleanliness is even more important and silver solder will not fill large gaps like soft solder so the parts need to fit each other more closely.
But soldering it is still easy. I have 4 kiln bricks I make my brazing hearth from. I solder in subdued lighting so I can watch the colour change of the metal, basically when it is a dull orange the solder will flow.
You need to get silver soldering correct the first time because desoldering a large silver part is nearly impossible.

Silver soldering is actually a form of brazing.
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tmuir


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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2010 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a bit behind where I wanted to be on this build as the front brakes on my mountain bike got critical on Friday after work so I ended up having to bleed the hydraulic system on them and fit new brake pads.
This is the first time I  had to do it so it took up all my machining time on Saturday.

But here is where we are at.

First off a shot of my blow torches I use for silver soldering.
The big one provides the main heat and the second can be used if I need a bit more heat in one spot.


Here I trimmed the base up using tin snips and have just started to machine the rest off.


Base machined and turned around to clean up the top ready for silver soldering.


Top all cleaned up.


Now I'm making the filling bush.
I'm using 8mm thread as my other one has a 5mm thread on it and its a bit too small making it hard to fill.
I've drilled it and now I'm tapping the thread.


Bush all machined and ready for parting off.


Here is all the parts so far.
The bolt I made some time ago and it was going to be part of a Hercules engine, but that engine never happened as I learnt that day to not to try and machine copper on the lathe. I ruined the completed boiler with filling bush so have had the bolt spare since.


Tomorrow I will drill the holes for the filling bush and wick tubes in the top and then silver solder it on.
I don't think I will get the bushes and wick holders soldered on until Tuesday night now.
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MrMamod


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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2010 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking great so far and i have built similar burners BUT i use the old brass cases which used to hold clock springs on a lot of mantle clocks and when they slip n knock a few teeth off a new ones fitted and the old one goes in the lathe to machine the rest of the teeth off then you end up with a very similar items to yours and most even have a small brass plate for the top with a hole in the centre.
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Les


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PostPosted: Sun May 23, 2010 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking good Tony.
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whistleman


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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2010 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that burner built like a brick outhouse.  


will be going straight to the pool room- If I had 1.



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tmuir


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PostPosted: Mon May 24, 2010 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whistleman wrote:
that burner built like a brick outhouse.  


will be going straight to the pool room- If I had 1.






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