Archive for The Unofficial Mamod and Other Steam Forum The Original Unofficial Toy Steam Forum Established 2006 The biggest, most popular global steam forum around! Accept NO imitations! We have a growing community of regular posting members who chat about all aspects of toy and model steam.          The Unofficial Mamod and Other Steam Forum Forum Index -> Locomotives alan2525 Mamod K1 Garratt? I like the look of the Beyer Peacock Garratt K1 (Currently operating on the Welsh Highland Railway) and for a time have been thinking what a Mamod K1 would look like, when I say Mamod K1, I mean a 16mm loco using wobbly cylinders! I found a drawing and scaled it at 16mm, and BY GOD - IT'S MASSIVE! 515mm long exc couplings. Boiler works out approx 60mm diameter and 210mm in length (inc smokebox) Boiler could also extend further into the cab if required! I think it will stay on paper (2 sheets of A4 edge to edge) for the time being! John R Garratt Hello Allan, I did the same thing a couple of weeks ago, and was stunned at the expected size of the finished model, I thought I might go with a "Rule " model and build her too suit the eye instead of scale!. I`ll let you know how it go`es, John. alan2525 Considering it's one of the smaller Garratts for 2ft gauge it is alarmingly large in 16mm. A smaller K1 built around similar proportions to the Mamod loco would still make for an attractive and very functional model, the tenders would lend themselves to fitting a water tank and top up pump and a large gas tank too. I'll look forward to seeing how your project progresses! Maybe a K0.5 Garratt? Dr. Rog Nicely fantastical thread! Are we talking of the correct engines? THE K1, as shown on: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garratt (scroll down a bit to " the first Garrat loco") is a nicely proportioned engine and clearly the Mamod boiler would do. The monstrous ex-SA railways engines are much bigger. I had wondered if using an SE3 engine like Bert Coules's double Fairlie (described on a thread somewhere) would have helped but seeing that neat chimney I am not so sure. Quiet frankly the dropped firebox is pure TE1. One good point is that I am sure it has been done. I am damned if I know where I saw one, an American web site I think.  Who knows.   I would suggest that the reduced wheelbase is not absolutely necessary, there is an issue of stability that may require a more precision wheelset. Others have infinitely more experience there. A roaring gas burner will be needed to supply that many cylinders. Possibly with a few extra steam tubes. I certainly like the idea of a water tank, low capacity seems to be a Mamod weakness that everyone snipes at.   alan2525 Yes it's the smaller Garratt on that webpage, the larger Garratts are impressive but not pretty! I like the K1, the first Garratt, you can see the thinking behind it, nice short 0-4-0 bogies, long wheelbase to sling the large boiler in the middle, large firebox to keep up with the extra set of cylinders, cab up high to accomodate the powered bogie underneath the footplate etc. A Mamod based loco would have it's own share of problems to negotiate, which would somewhat determine the overall dimensions and arrangement of the loco. Basing a loco on an actual prototype is awkward though as there needs to be some flexibility in the general arrangement and dimensions if using some off the shelf parts. Would be an interesting project though, and John's interest in a similar project is enough to spur me on! Charles M There was a series of posts about building a K1 on G ScaleMad Forum some months ago. The model used Roundhouse " Katie " mechanisms for the power bogies. It turned out to be a very  nice model. Was not a small model when it was done, as it was built for 16 mm scale. Charles M   alan2525 Was that the same K1 that appeared in Garden Rail last month or so? Using two Katie chassis works out very expensive though, would like some change out of £1000, the Mamod cylinders certainly appeal! Would be like two IP Janes, with a hefty boiler and 40psi on tap for half an hour or so, plenty of traction, controllability and power to boot! The cylinders could be dressed up with high and low pressure dummy cylinder covers too! ministeamer Hey, there's a K1 Garratt operating somewhere in Tasmania, apparently. Dr. Rog alan2525 wrote: Was that the same K1 that appeared in Garden Rail last month or so? Using two Katie chassis works out very expensive though, would like some change out of £1000, the Mamod cylinders certainly appeal! Would be like two IP Janes, with a hefty boiler and 40psi on tap for half an hour or so, plenty of traction, controllability and power to boot! The cylinders could be dressed up with high and low pressure dummy cylinder covers too! Having seen a Bowman with a six-wick burner last night (sorry for not referencing) I am with you on the big boiler, (=big burner). Come on Alan, get something knocked up on CAD! Titan alan2525 wrote: Would be like two IP Janes, with a hefty boiler and 40psi on tap for half an hour or so, plenty of traction, controllability and power to boot!! Sounds familiar!  Go for it, you will not be dissapointed, I am sure it will be awesome! John R Garratt Water Tank Allan and I were discussing this Loco` using Mamod Powered Engines either end, We thought maybe a 50mm Dia` Boiler might be the way to go!?. Added to this, I have done a little experimenting with a Gas Tanker following my Mamod which is set up to hook onto any other Live Steamer I wish to run!, This works well. I`m about to now build another Tanker to carrt Water, also for the Mamod, the rest of the Train can & will be hooked up behind these!. The Water Tank will be charged up to 60 PSI with air, The Boiler will run at 50 PSI, A small 1/4 x 40TPI Cock, Tap, Valve on the Tanker would be cracked open keeping the Boiler Topped up as needed!. My Gas Tanker is done and operational, I`m in the middle of working some Voodoo on the Water Tanker. My point is, The Water Tank on the Garratt can & in my case would be setup the same, with Gas in the other end!. Regards, John R alan2525 Re: Garratt Water Tank John R wrote: Allan and I were discussing this Loco` using Mamod Powered Engines either end, We thought maybe a 50mm Dia` Boiler might be the way to go!?. Added to this, I have done a little experimenting with a Gas Tanker following my Mamod which is set up to hook onto any other Live Steamer I wish to run!, This works well. I`m about to now build another Tanker to carrt Water, also for the Mamod, the rest of the Train can & will be hooked up behind these!. The Water Tank will be charged up to 60 PSI with air, The Boiler will run at 50 PSI, A small 1/4 x 40TPI Cock, Tap, Valve on the Tanker would be cracked open keeping the Boiler Topped up as needed!. My Gas Tanker is done and operational, I`m in the middle of working some Voodoo on the Water Tanker. My point is, The Water Tank on the Garratt can & in my case would be setup the same, with Gas in the other end!. Regards, John R Do you have any photos of your Gas and Water tanker? Regarding the gas tank what kind of pressure do you test the tank up to? I'm always a little wary of home built gas tanks as the working pressure of butane /  butane / propane mixed gas can be considerable, especially as pressure increases dramatically with temperature. I like the idea of a functioning water tank, although I'd probably fit a hand pump to overcome boiler pressure, rather than pressurise the system to reduce the need for a pressure vessel for the watertank. Would also make refilling the water tank simpler, as it could just be topped up with a funnel, so the tank could be much smaller. I always thought a tender would be useful to contain those, houses the fuel and water fairly protoypically and could be used with a number of locos too. A braided hose or flexible connector should really be used for the flexible gas pipe, rather than the silicone tube Mamod use on the William and new Loco. A dummy coal load could fairly conveniently cover the sheetwork over the top of the gas tank too. My latest loco is such a good runner too, it would be nice to fit a Radio Control system in the tender which could be used with a number of locos. A removeable servo and linkage mounted on a chassis could also be fitted in the cab, and swapped between locos if required, or removed when manual control is desired. John R Gas & Water Tank Hello again Alan, If you would be so kind as to pass on Intructions to an old Fart as to how Photo`s are uploaded to this Forum, I would be very pleased to Upload Piccies and Species of said Tanker!. Good to hear from you again!, John R. Nick John, please follow these instructions (by John Reid) and you should be able to get pictures on the forum: http://modelsteam.myfreeforum.org/about15589.html Roly Williams Nick wrote: John, please follow these instructions (by John Reid) and you should be able to get pictures on the forum: ... or, alternatively, just click on "Attach File" when posting. John R Uploading Pics & other junk Thanks for the Intructions Nick, I had lesson one, "Failed" Will try again tomorrow!, Alan, I couldn`t agree more to your statement about Gas Tanks, If I didn`t build it, I wont use it!. Hopefully I`ll get the Pics uploaded tomorrow as well!.           Species for the Gas Tank are as below: Lenth of Copper Tube : 80mm. Copper Tube Walls : 3.59mm. Bronze Convexed Ends : 8mm. Bronze Centre Stay : 12mm. Filler Valve : Rothmans??. Regulator : Roundhouse. Hold Down Stays : Bronze Strap : 3mm x 1mm. Wagon : Scratchbuilt on new Mamod Wagon Chassis & Wheels. With Jarrah Planks. Length O/all, 160mm plus Mamod Frieght Buffers.           Gas Tank was Hydrostatic tested too 300 PSI, I couldn`t get anyone to pump her up any further for me, My compressor is only good for 125 PSI, Thats Life!. Regards, John R John R Photo Upload test 2 Alan, if this works, here are the Photo`s I said I`d upload of my Gas Tanker!. : The plain Tanker incomplete!. : The Tanker, completed but fitted with a "Jury Rigged Gas Pipe" for Testing!. : The Tanker completed and fitted with the correct operational Gas Piping with plenty of Flexibility!. Gas Pipe has 5000 PSI rating. John R John R Photo` Transferring Instructions Well, A big thank you for the collective Photo` Transferring instructions you chap handed out, It would seem they worked well!. Regards, John Richards. dampfmaschinenjoe 1967 It was the german Modelengineer Ralph Dolata, who made the K 1 from scratch , only using the Roundhouse drives. He is famous for building big engines . His red  South African loco is a legend ! cheers Joe John Richards Gas Tanker Alan 2525, Further to the open discussion on the Gas Tankers strength, I decided to cut open a Commercial Butane Gas Can we use to run our Burners, Reason, was to have a Gander at the Internal Tank that holds the Gas inside!. Species` of Internal Tank: 1. Zero. 2. Outer Tank Species`: Steel Walls 0600th in thickness. Thats it, a Commercial Butane Tank is just that that you hold in your hand!. We of course are expected to build Armoured Tank to contain our gas???????. I will still prefer to use my Tanks as I build them, but, Go figure!!. Puzzled, John.        The Unofficial Mamod and Other Steam Forum Forum Index -> Locomotives Page 1 of 1