oxide finish + eng. base reinforcement, p 5

Reid · oxide finish + eng. base reinforcement, p 5

Wilesco D21

The factory finish of the polished brass boilers is a thin film of nitrocellulose lacquer
which quickly degrades in service.
The choice then is to either live with a blotchy finish, or strip the lacquer and become a polish slave (not a Polish Slav, no!).

For some time I've wanted to finish this boiler in an oxide colour,
and black-ish seems to be the first one to try.

Here's the boiler as it was until last night

The white powder is the residue that results after nearly 20 hours of NDB operation. The New Departure Burner makes no soot;

only ash

__________________

Now the engine is taken apart.

Boiler attachment point: a bent steel tang slips into the flattened tube

Progress follows with observations along the way

Prep included removing all traces of old lacquer and tarnish
then to grain the boiler with a green abrasive pad.
Leave no traces of oil or fingerprints. Chemically clean is the word

Here is the product I'm trying out

A weak solution, about 10% in warm tap water

I would have better used distilled water, inasmuch as our tap water is hard with lime, and this product is mildly acidic

the solution begins to make a result almost instantly. This shot taken after about ten minutes, maybe twenty, I forget

Within twenty minutes the boiler took on a dense, sooty blackish brownish colour

I removed the boiler from the soak, gave it a rinse, and wiped it partly with a clean paper towel.
Surprise, a bad surprise:

most of the black came right off, like soot, like Mark experienced.

However, I noted areas where the brass was keeping a dark stain,
so the thing to do is put it back into the soak and let it be.

Not satisfied with time alone, I put the container and boiler into the microwave and got the solution very hot! No fumes nor harm came of it.
All chemical reactions go faster with warmth.

Two hours later I repeated the rinse and wipe: much better!
Much of the boiler is a chocolate brown-black now.

But the top side of the boiler seem to be slower to fully develop its colour deeply enough to resist the wipe of the paper towel.

I think that time and patience are needed

So, there it rests at this time of writing: in the soak still, and there it will stay for a number of hours longer,

until, when rinsed and wiped with a wet towel, a reasonably dark and resistant oxide film remains.

I don't know that this is going to work out any more than you do.
Will give it every chance. I note that the drain pipe is nice and black and rub resistant.
The "take" of this stuff must depend very much on the type of brass itself.

Time will tell. Time to sign off.

More later.

Reid

Am thinking that Caswell sells this stuff to make money, not friends.

The lack of tips and directions is dismaying.

Why should the user have to settle for failure because there is no guidance at all?

Searching online, not finding a great deal of useful information aside from this page,
http://home.att.net/~ShipModelFAQ/smf-q033.html

excerpt, one person's input:

xlchainsaw

i dont think it will work. i use phospheric acid (rust converter) to clean black off brass. to my knowledge this finish is mostly used in metal sculptures .when this black film is achieved its normally dried and coated with a clear finish.to my knowledge the only way to blacken the brass is by heat treating and the success of that depends on the grade of brass. to remove the laquer easily ;use paint stripper. i believe the brass on older prewar boilers like bing ect had a grade of brass that went black with heat. hence you dont see many really old engines bright and shiney! thanks for reminding me!!!!! ill use phospheric acid to quickly clean the brass work on my project.

Reid

Hi Glen,

Whatever phosphoric acid is in this compound, it is not much in quantity;
I can't smell it nor really taste it on the fingertip.

The boiler is still in the soak. The color is chocolate black,
and now it does not wipe off to brass like it did last night.

To further ensure I get some depth of oxidation, the container and boiler are simmering at boiling temperature on the stove top.
I will keep it there for hours longer and then try a good hard rub test on the boiler bottom.

With a bit of luck and patience this may work out after all.

Caswell's customer support system is not working well.
I'll show you the results in the next posting form.

toxx

... hmmm, Reid. Caswell has a Wilesco-ish flavour concerning their concern with their customers.

P'raps leave the boiler in the solution for a week?

Reid

Caswell customer support's system requires one to fill out an online "ticket" requesting help.

Into the form you put all the information, then enter a hard to read verification code.

When you flub by failing to fill in any one of the confusing blank lines,
the submitted form bounces back, and in so doing, your tick of the box marked "urgent" defaults back to priority level, "low" (but you don't notice that, of course).

So, after about five tries I got the form to submit.

Here is the email result. They turn off their telephones at 4PM.
I tried to call but too late by ten minutes.

So that was a waste of time.

I do not recommend Caswell so far, not based on what I've seen,
not even if I get a satisfactory oxide finish, for if I do, it will be because I figured it out on my own.

The bottle of liquid concentrate costs over $30 US.
You'd think they'd have instructions more than what you see on the lable....

James

Bloody hell Reid! Hope it works out

Nick

Reid, you saved me from spending my money on it, I almost bought it.

I hope with your process that you have taken that you will get it to work.

Reid

Thanks Tom, thanks James!

I will make it work out. I will make it work out.

Looking around intensively online, here's the best hints found so far,
and this is why I am boiling the boiler at this time on the stovetop.

excerpted from
http://www.swdinc.com/black_oxide.htm
and this pertains most specifically to steel oxidation,
but also to brass and copper, insmuch as elevated temperature is considered important.
Refer back to the Caswell instructions: 85F max, which is nonsense, because all you get at room temperature is a wipe-off soot.

QUOTE:

What is it?
Black oxide is a conversion coating formed by a chemical reaction produced when parts are immersed in the alkaline aqueous salt solution
operated at approximately 285 degrees F. The reaction between the iron of the ferrous alloy and the hot oxide bath
produces a magnitite (Fe3 O4) on the actual surface of the part.

It is possible to oxidize non-ferrous metals under suitable conditions to form black oxides.

It is possible to apply black oxide at room temperature, however it is not possible to achieve all of the benefits available from the "hot" oxide process.
The cold black oxide process routinely shows color variation from part to part and the black material frequently rubs off in your hands.

The cold process does not meet military or automotive specifications. Therefore the remainder of this article addresses
the "hot" black oxide process.

END quote
----

Alright, so the solution I'm using is not alkaline, but bears a bit of phosphoric acid.

I have no pressure vessel by which to do this at 285F,
so I'm doing it at 200F instead.

Here's what I have so far, and it does resist rubbing with wet microfiber cloth:

Reid

out of the solution for a picture only, wiped hard with wetted microfiber cloth, rinsed, dried, photographed

Am pleased with the tone and depth.
I want to see how much more even I can get the coating.
It can be darker than this and still please me here.

It seems that: heat and time are a help.
It is vital to keep the part fully immersed,
and to stir or othewise move the solution is a help;
heating the solution sets up a natural circulation of course.

I erred and allowed the solution level to drop whilst unattended.
That exposed the boiler bottom, which hardly counts because it is not much seen.

Here is what happens when you let a portion of the object become exposed through evaporation or otherwise;
the oxide film is in part removed by the steaming vapours

boiler bottom upon discovery of my error, and after hard wiping with the cloths

Now, that's still wet with water in the upper half, that's why it looks blotchy there.
All of the soot has been wiped off the boiler though.

Now it is fully immersed again in hot solution.
Will see in some time how it does.
At intervals I can remove the boiler, rinse and wipe, and so adjudge
how well the colour evens out.

More later, thanks for thoughts, all of you.

Reid

When this is done with the bath I'll rinse and rub and dry it and apply a coat of synthetic oil and see if that won't maintain a nice low luster.

Synthetic oil has the good property of never going sticky or to varnish,
as do all petroleum oils over time.

It may be that I can spruce the appearance by wiping down after each run with an oiled cloth then.

It will work out.

Nothing worthwhile works the very first time, all by itself, just to please you.
You've got to make the damned thing work.

T.A. Edison

MooseMan

It does look very convincing.....

I've spent a fair bit of time around early 20th century German boilers of the Nuremberg variety....I'd be hard pressed to tell the difference in tone.

I once heard that chemical blacking was achieved by heating a boiler to a dull red heat and then quickly immersing it in crude oil....not sure how apocryphal that is though.

Reid

Hi Nick, glad to save your money, if this all fails.

Moose, thanks! That perspective of the general colour is great to learn.

true: high heat and quenching certainly do oxidize brass to a dark colour.

However, think that these old boilers were all soft soldered.
In which case, such a treatment could only be done to components in advance of the soldering,

and I do suppose that would be impractical because then they'd have to somehow clean and flux the joints without disturbing the oxide film that was the exterior.

Therefore, logic hints to us that the old oxide finishes, the graining too, all that, was done post-soldering,
and if that was so, then the process they used was primarily or entirely chemical.

Am pretty sure this will work out, no thanks at all to Caswell instructions or customer support.
They are a big outfit nowadays. Probably too big and busy to be able to spare attention to the little guys.

So it goes. When I reassemble, it will be in such a way that I can take it down next time with less trouble.

I can always re-do the boiler, and so this can be considered just a first trial.

Thanks for looking in. Keep your wallets closed for the time being,
right!

Reid

OK. Finding that the earlier removal and wipe and dry did not aid things.

Note that an hour later the vicinity of the steam fittings is streaked?

and the colour is blanching out there in particular?

Note too, another error of my doing: I allowed a plastic stirring spoon to graze against the metal in stirring the solution.
This made lengthwise marks. Stupid of me. Learning curves...

IF this thing were suspended in a roiling container of solution suppose that would help keep the staining action more even.

As it is, something about the solder--
leaches out and alters the staining power.

I have now scotchbrited it all off

and back into the tank for a retry.

And if I give it up in the end, I do say: I much prefer the grained brass look to polished brass for this workaday engine.
I would then leave it grained and let it oxidize down naturally to dull brushed brass;
not a bad look in itself.

xlchainsaw

my only advise as we are dealing with a film of oxidized black :when you achieve a good level of black how about placing the boiler in the oven to harden the coating before trying to wipe it off. then apply your oil and heat treat it also. that should create a durable heat resistant coating. it may be that the oil will also blacken under heat and even out the finish.

Reid

That's a very good idea.

I will wipe, though, with the wet microfiber cloths (they are wonderful cloths--get a multipack cheap at the auto parts store),
to remove the loose soot, lest it engrain itself and leave marks.

I found---and that earlier picture above shows, the result after quite firm rubbing under running water.
THAT tone was quite good enough and hard enough at that time,
but the boiler bottom (the thing lays in the pan upside down) was quite spoiled by the accidental exposure).

So if I can get back to where I was, great.
Then I will wipe gently, rinse, and bake it gently as you suggest--
I might better let it air cure for a time in the damp night air,
then bake, for once I've driven all the moisture and such from the pores,
whatever residual action will cease, including that of "setting" the film (I suppose, I don't know!)

But yes, a bake sounds like a good plan too and I will do that before I apply oil.

The commercial applications of oxide finish are wide and ubiquitous:
antique bronze/brass/copper hardware of endless description.
True, these things are generally overcoated with a clearcoat,
but even without that, the colour is well-set in the metal itself.
I must get that much from this process.

With time and practice and if necessary, a pressure cooker adjusted to the explosion point,
I could get an excellent oxide finish. Explode? No need!
This boiler will do that of its own accord in due time, ha ha.

Gee, Dad! It's...it was a Wilesco!

---

"Gee, Dad! It's a Daisy!"
http://mrcompletely.blogspot.com/2005/11/daisy-red-ryder-bb-gun.html
Origin of Gil's screen name for sure

Mister Occlusion

I've not had time to play with it myself any further, so it's good to see how it's working out. Mine started to go wrong when I heated the metal, but maybe I got too much heat on it.

What disturbs me a little is the way the brass turns to copper when the stuff comes off. How much is this solution leeching the zinc out, I wonder? admittedly it's only a thin coating on the surface, but still I would probably not leave something simmering away for a few days

I think what I am going to do is leave my boiler nickel and try this stuff on the copper plated firebox. And if I strip the copper than I guess it will be gun blueing on the steel again.

Reid

I think too Mark that the oxide action works more on the zinc than on the copper. Pictures above sort of bear that out.

----

EUREKA, it is done!

To recap: I regrained the boiler to brass a couple of hours ago.
The oxide film was firm but very thin. It is thin. We know the old boilers have only a thin oxide finish.

About two hours at a slow boil in the used solution;
I took it out. I really really like the colour! I've elected to go no further.

It is several shades lighter than I had it before.
This is the right colour for me for now.
I only wish to give you guys a much better photograph soon.

Picture coming up though I really need daylight to get a true rendition.

Stand by one moment please?

Reid

Still wet at the bottom...

I'd describe this as a pewter-toned or smoked gold.
It is wonderfully beautiful in person. This image does little justice.

The way to do this staining operation, then, if I have it right:

Glass (Corningware cooktop) type of container.
Distilled water can't hurt, though I used tap water.

WEAK concentration, try 2 percent first.

The object must be perfectly grease and fingerprint free.
There will be oil and crap inside a boiler which must be removed.
Get it super clean so it passes the "water break test"; meaning:
that water sheets from the surface without the least tendency to bead.

BOIL the item slowly, this is to get the most activity from the solution,
but mostly, to circulate the solution and prevent flocculent soot from forming on the item,
which may act as a blanket and cut off the direct contact of the solution.

If this weak a solution, say, 2%, gives too-slow results, be patient.
If need be, increase the strength. But then you may get a lot more soot.
Not sure at all about how this reaction goes--these words are best-guesses.

The main desirables: Give it as much heat as possible but more so:
give it time, time and more time.

There are no fumes to notice. Just steam. Wife should not take offense.

You may, with a clean wet microfiber cloth (I like no other kind),
lift the item out and wash it in the tap with dish detergent to inspect the surface along the way, rinse and put it back in the pot if needed.

And this becomes an easy to manage process.
It's all a matter of making the goddam stuff work.

Thank you for your inspiring words, Mr. Edison!
Many a time I'd have given up a project if not for your quoted words
ringing in my head: Nothing worthwhile works right the very first time...

What I have here now is an oxide coating that will not just rub off.
I know I can scratch it. I could polish it away if I were a fool,
but it won't dissipate nor wipe off under a cloth. It is on there for good.

Reid

Glen, I could not resist waiting nor to bake so now the boiler is oiled.

It looks much cooler in person than even this image can show.

The finish is done and it won't rub off.

Nick

That looks a lot better!

Reid

Thank you Nick! It is nearly perfect all over.

We note that the oxide finish does not cover nor disguise scratches in any way.

A grained finish such as from the green pad is so fine as to not tend to catch dirt,

but the grained finish is desirable here with an oxide film;
it tends to refract some of the light---giving the item a much more interesting sheen than high gloss.

So there it is! Now I can proceed to further chop the firebox,
which is in progress now.

More images of the next steps then, though they don't pertain to the boiler finish per se.

It may turn out all right again. (thanks Nick, again).

xlchainsaw

i like it but im a little concerned about the "raw" oil used to polish it. i still think you should place the lot in a warm oven or place it in the hot sun just to stabilize it. its a beautiful finish gives it the antique bronze effect. if the boiler was just a ornament i wouldnt be worried ,but knowing you ......... it will be fired! and worries me

xlchainsaw

ive wanted you to get there reid without stealing your thread. the process you have done is called pickling. a google search "pickling brass" will give you a lot of info on the subject. i have other recipes for this process. this is probally why the supplier of your product doesnt respond well. ive pickled brass before many times but not on a boiler.personally i like polished brass but as you have said you dont then i respect that. anyway the finish can be removed without difficulty. i have recipes for this. again well done.

Reid

We'll see if she don't blow up on me. My thought is that the water from the pores can pass out through the microscopic thin oil film.
It was quite dry in its way and I intuit no future catastrophes.
Oh. Doorbell. Excuse me?

---

News on the March (in march, no less!)

Bulletin, API Wire Services

Miami, Florida

In a strangely cluttered two car garage, tended to by an old and sick dog,
a master eccentric is at work, desecrating a once-beautiful German made model steamer engine.

Here, at his fold-up workbench, Reed Welsch is busy bending and breaking holes into the fireplace of a Wileosco B21 steamer engine.
He holds a red and black Drumel grinding tool to the work. It slips.
Blood flies into Mr. Walch's eyes. Challenged, he reaches for a small hammer and gives a sharp whack to the grinder.

Next he goes to a filthy shelf and rummages through containers of old grease, oil and spoiled milk.
An old fashioned glass bottle is produced, black bakerlight capped, and filled with some strange black liquor.
"Oh, no this is not to drink! This is asphaltum varnish that I made from raw materials many years ago when I was a young genius,
before the accident. It's a black paint, same as Henry Ford used on all those Model T Furds."

This reporter asks, why make black paint? Why not buy a spray can?

"What fun would that be? Besides, I can brush this on and it will look just great, no brush marks really, and blacker than black!"

We bid the loon goodbye, to paint his steamer's fireplace in his own way,
and note: don't all blacks look the same?

Mr Woolsh says that they vary and that his black is the truest black.

"Not only that, but it's simply and purely made of the world's oldest deposits of petroleum, a fossilized resin called 'gilsonite'.
So when this paint goes on and dries, it will be the newest paint job in the world for a nanosecond,
made from the oldest paint material in the world, about a half billion years old."

Now we really bid the guy goodbye.
He's nuts, as you by now well know.

Reid

Les

That boiler looks really good, better than the original.
Well done. Thumbs up!

Reid

Hi Les! Well, it's a matter of what one likes.
I see so many beautiful, bright boilers brass or sometimes nickel.

We don't these days see old time oxide finishes so often.
And so that's one more reason for me to have done this.

NOW, let's move on to the firebox! That reporter

got all the facts wrong but one:

what you are soon to see is not truly a paint, but a flint-hard asphalt,
practically pure asphalt from the oldest vein in the world.

First some lead-up pictures. I've opened the sides full-up;
the three pretty brass grommets in the Wilesco base are but brass plated steel,
already rusting through the plating on their inside surface.
The strange shaped side opening about to be shown was merely a matter of convenience,
in connecting the dots. If later I realize that a rectangular hole would look better, I'll do that then. For now, this was easy.

OH and we're gonna have a steaming stack again, but with a real waste collection and disposal system.
The stack will steam much more vigorously than stock condition ever does.
You'll all see why shortly. Much thought went into this absolutely silly idea....

Reid

First to show the condensate disposal and steamstack plan:

an old plastic funnel, heat-formed to the contour of the smoke box
by the oven, softening the funnel first, then into the box, both into the oven, 250F.

when fitted for good it will be silicone glued in place

steam exhaust will go back into the factory hole
and through the side of the plastic funnel

"motor slush" was Henry Ford's name for gilsonite dissolved in solvents
This is the stuff that axle assemblies were dunked into for a quick-dry protective finish. Also motors!

the handle end of a "hake" brush: best paint brush in the world,
cheap too!

ancient technique still good. fine soft hair of dog, or something. rat? soft soft!

still perfect years after bottling. this stuff never goes bad in the can

it is pure resin, and has no pigment per se---it is black black by nature.
this is a ground coat only for the varnish-version yet to come

note how it flows out, and pulls way from crevices due to its lack of pigment or filler.
it is uber, uber black stuff.
Laser light does not reflect from it; gets trapped in the film instead

----

Gilsonite is rust inhibiting and resistant to all chemicals other than petroleum solvents.
So long as I don't wash it with white spirit it will hold well, perfectly meths proof and good for 450F at least.

More later!

Nick

With that new firebox, you can really monitor the flame.

Reid

Hi Nick!

toxx

... the boiler looks great, Reid!

And I liked the story about The loon who came into the Garage ...

Say, do you own a Furd Model D? I used to know a man with a shaved-off moustache who had one.

Reid

Hi Tom, yessir, I am a former Model T man. It's all I drove for years.
I restored a '22 coupe (modding it like I do the Wilesco) and it was great fun!
Why, that car would start on the switch, quite often (no starter, I took that out as being dead weight).
Other times it would require endless cranking and still refuse to start.
It took me everywhere, at all hours, and never broke down.
----

Here's the colour contrast of the boiler against what will be all-black soon.

The boiler finish, now that I see it in daylight, is far from perfectly even.
However, that's fine. It looks good and will get stained further in service,
and I can always do it over again, and get a more perfect job now that I have an inkling what to do.

Thanks for looking in, Tom and Nick and Glen and all.
I'm having fun, or meaning too, and of all this endeavor,
the painting is for me the most fun of all, this ancient material that once was life itself. Poetic paint, in a sense.

Cheers, now off to Nod,
zzz, zzzz, sneeze, cough, zzzzzzz

jamespetts

I shall be intrigued to see it all finished!

Reid

I'll carry on with the work soon. Our little dog has been sick lately.
It at last died last night here at home of natural causes.
I'm not up to working right now but will get on with the firebox paint and etc, maybe today.

----

Two things meanwhile:
Mr. Caswell wrote to me about my inquiry questions re: how to use the gun metal blue for copper product.

He says two things: Of course don't use tap water.
Well, then put that into the sparse directions then.

Also says it won't hold up to heat.
Well then, say so in the directions then.
I have sent him a pointer to this thread
and Mr. Caswell may possibly look at what has been the result of my making the stuff work on my own terms.

Am quite sure that for a boiler, with its mixed metals of brass and solders,
heat and solution circulation are needed.
Slow boiling supplied both those aspects.

Now, I know this finish will hold up to boiling water heat at least because it was made in boiling water, plus I baked the boiler in the oven at 250F.
I suppose that Mr. Caswell's warn against heat was made more in mind of flame heat of hundreds of degrees higher?

And also I am hard pressed to see any difference between what I have above
and what our friend Roger has on his original 1961 Fleischmann's boiler,

image purloined from Rog's pages

http://www.indianarog.com/

Colour varies with room light and camera settngs. My images are not working to show the real look.

Rog's image and the boiler here look to be just about the same warm & rich oxide colour.

More later, thanks.

Les

We are sorry for your loss.

toxx

Reid, my friend! I found this wonderful sentence:

Ich wünschte, sie könnten ewig bei uns bleiben. Doch sie gehen nur vorraus. Ich hatte einen Kameraden.

Here's to Petey, Reid! Salute!

Cave canem.

Atticman

Sorry to hear of your loss Reid, even when poorly and expected it is hard to take when it happens.

Nick

Sorry to hear about Petey.

When I first saw your results, that Fleischmann boiler is exactly what I thought of.

Does anyone have one of those Fleischmann boilers, that has had the finished polished off? Well, thanks to Reid, you can now restore it to original.

Reid

Thanks all.

Am quite sure we have a pretty good match of colour and tone here,
right down to the graining, apparently.

Of course this oxide will stand up to steam boiler service.
The only extreme heat is on the bottom, anyway, and even that is limited by the water contained in a boiler.

"Oxide" is oxide so to speak.
The boiler will further oxidize and even blue in areas, as did the polished brass in its own way in service.

jamespetts

I'm very sorry to hear about the dog

toxx

... Reid, will you also 'blue' the steam and water pipes? The procedure was fascinating to watch. The result intriuging and satisfying. Would I have to remove the nickel-plating on my D24 boiler to try your method?

Dogs on my mind. I salute Petey!

James

Ahh shit Reid, so sorry to hear about Pete

Reid

Thanks for the shoulders. It's OK about Pete's passing.
I wouldn't make a fuss of it here, only a notice because
of a former topic telling about his reprieve last Feb. 1st.
We got five good weeks longer together for that.

I did my sobs in private in the small hours---
even though I'd promised myself that I would not grieve.

There's a component in our brains, in some primitive, infantile part,
which demands to make us cry over what cannot be altered.
Pete never cried or complained or felt sorry for himself.

------

I'll get onto the painting tonight, a very quick and easy finish,

and here, to correct an error I made at disassembly of the Wilesco:

the front boiler mount need not be removed from the firebox.
I did not realize that in time.

Here, take a close look at the Wilesco tour video at 14 seconds in:

The removal and installation of the boiler is done by manipulating only the rear end tab.

Reid

johnreid

Sorry to hear of your loss Reid, our furry friends are members of our families.

mc_mc

I really like the "glow" from the boiler now. My Doll upright looks just that colour.

It'll be interesting to see how the coating holds up to direct flame and steaming.

Reid

Thanks John--for all it is an abstract, but a reminder too that our pets are as personal to us as any family members can be.
There are unwanted pets being thrown away while I write.
If I can ever bear to take on another one, I will. It's the eventual loss that makes me resist adopting again right away.

----

mogogear

A late tune in to your amazing adventure with the Caswells products. What a great experimenter your Reid. The Henry Ford Black is a great tribute as well.

The finish is so much better for a working boiler.... I will bet even money that as time goes by it will acquire even more enhancement from use.

A nice read this evening back home... Thanks for your time spent on the stove and bench and the keyboard..

Maggie my Old English Sheep Dog sends a generous lick your way!!

Reid

Thank you Mo and all. Thank you.

Here's Part One of a lonnnng fireside chat.

I'm no FDR. Call it a Firebox Chat

part 1

part 2

More to come: showing cans of 100 year old varnish, still good,
discussing why this can be so,
and more about the forgotten good properties of gilsonite as a surface coating.

I'll paint and talk
but not chew gum at the same time;
wouldn't be prudent!

Wallace

Reid, it has been great to browse through this thread. Very interesting too, so thanks for posting.

I really like the look of the boiler. As much as brass looks good shiny, a darkened boiler always looks so much better to me

mc_mc

This is my Doll, it's a rich chocolate colour and just glows. The surface does have some sort of marks / pitting which I've been too scared to have a rub at to see if they will come off.

Reid

Michael, It's so lovely.
Give us a close up when and if you can of the boiler so we can see any and all marks and patina of age?

===

Wallace! *thanks*

Reid

Rough cut almost finished,

Fresh Paint 500 Million Years Old

It shows the going-on of the first coat.

Whilst this video uploaded the second coat was applied and air dried for an hour.

Firebox now in the oven, and has, probably, nearly no brush marks
(surprising to me because this is an oil-less version of japan black)

I'll show the final result of two coats later in this day,
and finish the video properly, make a new upload.

Thanks for following along all this silly process and progress.
It's much easier to do than for you to watch or for me to tell about.

self-leveling result of the first coat:

The second coat is done, curing in the oven.

toxx

Dear Reid! Just a quick tip, since I'm on the run: May I suggest not using epoxy resin for reinforcement of the base plate? I recommend 2 steel or brass plates, strips or perhaps a sheet cut into better, rectangular form, screwed into place. You could use the holes for the fly wheel mount, inserting longer screws to fasten the reinforcement plate(s). To my mind, a more elegant solution than epoxy - even though it won't be visible. Steel on steel or metal upon metal just (TMM) sounds better. Would also make dismanteling easier.

Off I go, got a bus to catch!

Reid

Hi Tom!

It will be a neatly done composite no matter how it it done.
Thanks so much for ideas!

toxx

Dear Reid!
There was a fine blonde girl on the bus. Sometimes, we Viennese encounter plain-clothed Schwarzkappler (Black Caps), asking to check our tickets. Asked the Schwarzkappler the blonde girl: "Your fare?", answers she: "Yes, I am".
A fine story, yet rendered ridiculous since in German, there is no similarity to fair and fare, as there is in English.
I leave you to ponder upon this riddle, while I buzz off to a green pasture says
Occasionally sane,
Tom

Reid

Gilsonite japan two coat work.

no surface perfecting was done prior to painting on the gilsonite; only scuffed with sandpaper and scouring powder.

Looks precisely like glass enamel;
no polishing or rubbing-out has been done.
This is how it dries

Reid

Nick

That finish is amazing!

And it is definately BLACK.

jamespetts

Ahh, the black boiler surround goes very well with the black base - far better than the default garish red! Well done.

Reid

Hi Nick, Hi James!

for direct comparison, compare the base of the feedwater pump to the firebox.

The feedwater pump base is in gloss black of high quality from a spray can.

This contrast of near black against asphaltum's true black is only noticed in broad daylight or by proximity.

The black level of the firebox will decrease a bit once it has been handled, wiped; micro-scratched by normal usage.
But it will always be shades blacker than pigmented black paints.

Odd stuff. Nobody has ever written about this material's unique blackness, not in books, not in the literature, not online, other than myself.

I'm the only....appreciator

(or was!)

Nick

I thought you like the red color?

(3rd post):

http://modelsteam.myfreeforum.org...ghlight=wilesco+paint&start=0

Reid

Nick

I like it both ways too, but I just had to post it.

Reid

I know. You are the postman.

38 thousand posts and increasing,
and always good tidings brought.

Thank you Nick.

johnreid

The Postman always rings twice.

Les

Wallace

Reid that firebox is amazing. Top stuff

Reid

Thanks Wallace! It must be the easiest finish ever to do.
If only today we had such good brushing paints.
I used to paint whole panels of the Ford T with the varnish version of this stuff.
It sounds impossible to believe, but there would be no brush marks.

Today's paints just can do that. So we have to spray paint as a rule; a shame, because most of our work is amenable to brushing,
so much more pleasant and relaxing work.

---------------

I have a question guys--can you help, anyone?

Q: How is the Wilesco power cylinder to be opened non-destructively?
I'm not going to open it now, but at some time in the future, perhaps.

open sesame!

Reid

Sexxxy

pictures may come in a few days!

----
For right now though it is apart.

Here's the engine on its mount, with the captive shroud.
I've slotted the shroud so it can be taken off.
The red shroud will be painted black soon.

The steam exhaust pipe is now larger than the stock pipe stub seen here

---

Here is the flexible engine base plate that I wanted to stiffen
to stop the power pulses from making the whole flywheel seem to wobble,

the flywheel wobble, only present when the work load is heavy, isn't due to any looseness,
but because the tinplate support for the bearing bracket pumps up and down from the con rod's torque!

----
What I had on hand was this piece of 1/4 square aluminium.
It may not be the ideal I-beam (it's not) but it is plenty stiff

The only way to do this without making screw and bolt holes, is to bond with epoxy. (am sorry, Tom, but no one will see it at least)

It looks terribly crude. It is maximally stiff. Function over form,
plus, all that stuff is removable without harm to the metal or even the factory paint

---
Another hopeful improvement: a less restrictive steam exhaust pipe.

The factory size pipe on the right, the new pipe on the left,
and in the background is the slip-sleeve for the new pipe to telescope into and get soldered.
Must bend some elbows next.

Thanks for looking in and shaking heads, no doubt.
The doings of all this stuff is all new to me, first engine, first time modding a toy steam engine.
So I have fun making errors and hits and runs, once in a while (baseball).

Cheers,

jamespetts

Reid,

interesting shots there! Had you thought of cladding your boiler to improve its efficiency?

As to the cylinder, I did try looking at my D16 last night to see whether there was a way of taking apart the cylinder: I couldn't find one, unfortunately. The D16 is different to your D21 in that the D16 has, and the D21 evidently doesn't have, a screw hole in the back of the cylinder for attaching a back plate for the cylinder lagging, which is made steam-tight with a fibre washer. However, beyond that, I could not clearly see how it was held together or how to take it apart non-destructively.

Good luck with your improvements, though: I should be interested to know whether the larger diameter exhaust, in particular, makes a difference.

Reid

Hi James!

jamespetts

Reid,

interesting thoughts

As you will have seen from my photographs, I have used ceramic fibre insulation on my boiler, but, as you will also have seen, my attempt at painting it was somewhat less than successful, leaving me with a singularly unaesthetic mess. Moreover, kaowool, as I am using, is an irritant to the skin, so is best to avoid touching it: however, so avoiding is difficult when it is atop the boiler.

Your idea of using a thin sheet of copper to go over the top of the kaowool might work well - do you think that it would work for something of the scale of a Stuart 504? If so, what thickness of sheet would you recommend? (Remember, for my boiler, it would have to fit beneath the brass bands).

Returning to your engine, aside from the boiler, had you had any thoughts of insulating the steam pipe? The surface area to volume ratio on a pipe is, of course, very high, so heat losses from the pipe between the boiler and the engine are likely to be significant, plus the pipe can get very hot, so insulating is good finger protection. I have heard that people have had good results from insulating steam pipes on Stuart engines and others of a similar size. Just a thought

. Do keep us up to date...