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The Unofficial Mamod and Other Steam Forum
The Original Unofficial Toy Steam Forum
Established 2006
The biggest, most popular steam forum around! Accept NO imitations!
We have a growing community of regular posting members who chat about all aspects of toy and model steam.
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Manxman
Steam Legend!!
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 3341
Location: Isle of Man
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 Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| MamodFan wrote: | | Manxman wrote: |
The bit that's really frustrating is that Fred Crammond knows the guy with all the Butcher models in that pic. I sent the man a letter last year with Fred going as a go between but got no answer.  and this year, the guy didn't even bring his Butcher mobiles to STIA. How sad is that. |
Why is it sad Manx? |
Sad, because I didn't go last year but did this year and one of main reasons I went was because I was hoping to see those models again. Then he didn't bring them and brought other parts of his collection instead.
And also sad because their is someone out there, with all the history and knowledge but I can't communicate with him. I'd love to know more about these models.
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MamodFan
Full member
Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 829
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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We must respect peoples privacy and the decisions they take about their collections. the owner of the models is a regular contributor to STEAM Magazine. All collectors are different, some like to share every single new acquisition others quietly collect away on their own
An awful lot of very interesting and useful information appears in that little quarterly magazine. It is a shame that more people on this forum do not subscribe to it although many are more than willing to use information from their websites. It has also been the case that text and images from STEAM have made it onto forums and websites without crediting the source.
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Manxman
Steam Legend!!
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 3341
Location: Isle of Man
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| Posted: Sat Jun 07, 2008 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with you but I'm also a member of STEAM. I wonder if he knows how interested people would be in his knowledge. Maybe an article for STEAM, I don't care. 
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Mamodman123
Steam God!
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 31110
Location: Midlands, UK
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 12:32 am Post subject: |
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| MamodFan wrote: | We must respect peoples privacy and the decisions they take about their collections. the owner of the models is a regular contributor to STEAM Magazine. All collectors are different, some like to share every single new acquisition others quietly collect away on their own
An awful lot of very interesting and useful information appears in that little quarterly magazine. It is a shame that more people on this forum do not subscribe to it although many are more than willing to use information from their websites. It has also been the case that text and images from STEAM have made it onto forums and websites without crediting the source. |
Partly agree there I'm a bit of both, most I show and some I keep to myself. I think its a little sad when people buy engines and lock them away for the best part of 20 years, if you go to shows and have them on display then thats fine.
Another theory regarding stealing collections
It wouldn't pay someone to steal a toy steam engine, the top ones worth about 1000 pounds? I'm not saying you should but it would be a lot quicker and easier to rob a car, worth thousands more. If the thieves were clever enough to research these toys, they'd be after the big stuff worth thousands not the toys. If someone steals an SE4 you've got to find the right buyer which could take weeks. If you want to sell a laptop or sat nav you can sell it down the pub in five minutes..... The longer the thief has it the more chance they have of being caught...
Sorry if that makes me look dodgy  Now where's that balaclava and sack with dollar sign on? 
Credit to the people that make the steam magazine, I wouldn't subscribe, nor do I steal information from it either. Why pay for it when you can get just as much information on here? Whilst being able to interact with the owner and the whole steam world? I think forums are criticized too much for bunking up prices, the rare stuff always commanded higher prices than the not so common stuff. A couple of years ago SW1's were being sold by me for 90-100 unboxed, these days you'd be happy to get 70. Collectors of the rare stuff must communicate outside of forums, be it via phones or email, if an SE4 was listed tomorrow then I'm sure the majority of the bidders wouldn't be part of this forum. How long does it take for someone to search "mamod" on ebay and see an SE4? It's not hard to miss is it? 
If I wasn't part of this forum (or a less popular forum) then I'd still bid on SE4's Bowmans and whatever comes up.
Yes you can argue that forums have enabled people to learn more about the rare models, yes they have, but nothing puts them in the shop window more than ebay, and people that inform the sellers about what they've got. Thats how I first found out about a pre-war SE3 ad watched it go for 300 3 years ago, one last week went for £320. Twenty quid over three years... speaks for itself. You could also argue that the bible and that steam magazine have had an effect on prices, even STIA and Kempton especially, everyone that goes to car boot sales will be looking for SE4's. The "Forum effect" is minimal, if there is such a thing then its a lot less effective than the above scenarios...
Rant over 
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Great to see those lesser known models Manx. I remember you getting the first one off ebay ages and ages ago. I hope you can find more info about these models, its a shame the bottom picture was removed so we can't see the other models... oh well doesn't surprise me.
MM
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Stitch
Full member
Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 873
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 1:29 am Post subject: |
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| Great engine Manx. They are both something a little different |
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Wallace
Supermoderator
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 11081
Location: New South Wales, Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 2:52 am Post subject: |
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| MamodFan wrote: | We must respect peoples privacy and the decisions they take about their collections. the owner of the models is a regular contributor to STEAM Magazine. All collectors are different, some like to share every single new acquisition others quietly collect away on their own
An awful lot of very interesting and useful information appears in that little quarterly magazine. It is a shame that more people on this forum do not subscribe to it although many are more than willing to use information from their websites. It has also been the case that text and images from STEAM have made it onto forums and websites without crediting the source. |
I apologise to Manx for the off topic twist here.
If there has been any text or images posted on these forums from STEAM, without credit, or if copyright has been breached, please PM myself, or another Mod so it can be recitifed
Thanks
Now back on topic
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Manxman
Steam Legend!!
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 3341
Location: Isle of Man
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 4:53 am Post subject: |
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| Wallace wrote: | | MamodFan wrote: | We must respect peoples privacy and the decisions they take about their collections. the owner of the models is a regular contributor to STEAM Magazine. All collectors are different, some like to share every single new acquisition others quietly collect away on their own
An awful lot of very interesting and useful information appears in that little quarterly magazine. It is a shame that more people on this forum do not subscribe to it although many are more than willing to use information from their websites. It has also been the case that text and images from STEAM have made it onto forums and websites without crediting the source. |
I apologise to Manx for the off topic twist here.
If there has been any text or images posted on these forums from STEAM, without credit, or if copyright has been breached, please PM myself, or another Mod so it can be recitifed
Thanks
Now back on topic |
No worries, but not me. No pictures have been removed from my post. The photo from STIA 2007 taken by Mike Jane was freely given to me by him and so I guess I own it. But I'm grateful to him for taking it for me and it's still here.
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MamodFan
Full member
Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 829
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:44 am Post subject: |
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| Manxman wrote: | | I agree with you but I'm also a member of STEAM. I wonder if he knows how interested people would be in his knowledge. Maybe an article for STEAM, I don't care. |
Glad to hear you are a member Manx, as are a number of others here, its a good little publication and an invaluable source, they have a can you identify this section, most useful.
The owner is a most knowledgeable man, probably the foremost authority on British Toy Steam and a good friend, he was collecting and researching British engines whilst everybody else was ignoring them for the more highly prized German models. It was he that fired my interest in this area.
A few thoughts on others comments.
MM
Its great to see collections on display, it is a shame when collections are locked away, must admit to being guilty of that in the past, but at the end of the day they bring me great enjoyment
To say you wouldn't subscribe to STEAM because you can learn more for FREE here is a little strange, the contributors to STEAM know the answers to the Butchers question, no-one here does. Whilst this forum offers a great deal of information and discussion, I have taken particular interest in the Australian and New Zealand Models of which I knew very little, can you point me to the thread that tells me the History of Mersey Models and GEM models or where the discussion about Simpson Fawcett is? This information is not freely available on the Net.
Talking of Free on the Net, this is another grip that some people have, would it be fair that subscribers pay for the mag and then suddenly information comes to light and is published on the net .
On the collecting circles outside the forum, you are correct, word does get around when models are up for sale. How many people know that a Boxed SE4 changed hands at STIA this year. What you find is with these collectors is that everyone knows what others are collecting and models are offered to people accordingly, its not a cartel you often find that engines are passed around for little or no profit. Swapping is a great thing, I have benefited from it, strange to see one of my old engines turn up on here now.
I'm not going into the "forum effect" we have done that here many times.
As to copy write issues, one that stands out in my mind was a Picture of a group of Cyldon engines with the text that appeared in STEAM. I cant remember who posted it as it was some time ago. It was dealt with as I remember.
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steamyman
Steam Legend!!
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 3114
Location: Australia.
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:48 am Post subject: |
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| nice pair of machines there. |
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Roundy
Junior Member
Joined: 02 Jul 2007
Posts: 228
Location: reading
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 7:50 am Post subject: |
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Well done mate they look really good- i et they r really powerfull with the single ossilating cylinder and gear drive- i had always wanted to try that on some thing lol
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scorpion2nz
Junior Member
Joined: 27 Apr 2008
Posts: 158
Location: Hawkes Bay NZ
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:36 am Post subject: |
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| ot just a little bit what is this Steam mag you are discussing please |
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MamodFan
Full member
Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 829
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| Posted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:52 am Post subject: |
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Hi
It is quarterly magazine published in this country, running to 16 pages each issue it contains information about a wide variety of Toy Steam engines. The Bowman Circle and STEAM are merging together from the next issue
all details can be found here
http://www.bowmancircle.co.uk/
and
http://www.steam-toys-engines-and-models.co.uk/
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